The Presiding Bishop of the Episcopal Church plans to poll the House of Bishops in April 2008 for approval of a plan to move the possible deposition of Bishop Bob Duncan of Pittsburgh forward from September 2008 to May 2008.
The Presiding Bishop of the Episcopal Church plans to poll the House of Bishops in April 2008 for approval of a plan to move the possible deposition of Bishop Bob Duncan of Pittsburgh forward from September 2008 to May 2008.
No comment.
Apparently, any dissent from the whims of the Presiding Bishop is now viewed as hate speech, so… “no comment.”
No comment as well. The actions of the PB speak for themselves. if I were to write what I really feel T19 would place me on moderated status. I am not sure which actions are worse.
Intercessor
I look forward to Schori “listening” to +Duncan in order to hear his personal experience, and then “reconciling” with him.
When pigs fly.
It is reported that Pope Benedict is content to have a smaller but more ideologically consistent church. The idea must be catching.
Let’s turn this around. All these occasions are opportunities to witness for Jesus Christ. All these occasions show the brokenness of the Church to folks in the uncomfortable middle. It is awful to have been forced to this point but what better way to honor God than to witness to his truth under duress? What better illustration of his Grace made perfect in weakness?
[blockquote]10 Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
11 “Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. 12 Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.”[/blockquote]
Matt 5:10-12
Why are we surprised at the attacks and trials and persecutions of godly bishops? Our Lord promised us that such would happen. I think, for Holy Week, that we should read and meditate on the farewell discourse in John – particularly chapter 16. [blockquote]”I have said all this to you to keep you from falling away. [b]The will put you out of the synagogues[/b]; indeed, the hour is coming when whoever kills you will think he is offering service to God. [b]And they will to this because they have not known the Father, nor me.[/b]
John 16:1-3, emphasis mine[/blockquote]
I pray that we seek the faithfulness of the Apostles as we face our trials. Let this time drive us to our knees, rather than drive us to anger. The space between the sole of the foot and the knee is the level that will move the world.
YBIC,
Phil Snyder
sorry, I forgot to close the last “bold” tag. It should be closed after “Father, nor me.”
YBIC,
Phil Snyder
KJS gives the appearance of a commander who believes she has achieved a major strategic breakthrough, and is rushing to exploit the breech.
Indeed, things must look pretty good from her perspective. At home, she has arrogated powers equivalent to an Episcopal form of Martial Law, and no one calls her to account. Indeed, they cheer her on. Her opponents are divided and scattered, and each day bleed people. She can trust deep pockets to attrit the remainder into defeat.
Abroad, the AoC has accepted her golden leash, and will at least acquiesce as she seeks to remake the AC in TECs image – a federation of national churches united only by history. Her major opponents in this task prepare to leave, and those who remain are again divided. The upcoming Lambeth Conference will seal this very outcome. She must feel total victory is in her grasp.
The irony of course is that once she wins, she will find herself possessing nothing of value. She will have destroyed the communion and turned it into a sycophantic Empire of dying churches. But she will be the master of all she surveys – the historic figure who shattered the Anglican Communion, castrated (metaphorically-speaking) the AoC, and toppled the CoE into ruin.
But the Church will go on as it has for 2000 years.
carl
What would prevent the Diocese of Pittsburgh from meeting early in a special convention to ratify their previous vote in which they approved changes in their constitution removing all mention of The Episcopal Church and accepting membership in the Province of the Southern Cone, as we did in December? Wouldn’t that upset KJS’ plans to depose Bishop Duncan so that Pittsburgh’s move could be nullified?
It’s all quite simple. This is a “get back” resulting from VGR’s rebuff from Lambeth.
It’s about time.
One might argue that Duncan stands for Christianity, or “the Church,” but it is clear he has aboandoned the communion of The Episcopal Church. My guess is that being deposed would be meaningless to him, and that he would carry on in another province. But it is something The Episcopal Church must do to keep its house in order. Believe me, I know about deposition first hand!
#12, you may be right. But this just sends the message, reinforcing what is already believed about ECUSA, that loyalty to the General Convention is more highly valued than loyalty to the Gospel.
[i][u]Keep[/i][/u] it’s house in order? Merciful Heavens, it’s a little late for that!
I’ll comment because the Presiding B.. can’t touch me.
I think that when the history of this ground-breaker is written she and her kind will be seen as boorish, ill-tempered, and mere token figureheads who brought few viable gifts to their positions. This single incident shows what tactics are afoot with her and that she can’t remember which face to show to whom. So much for the comprehensive diversity or whatever that jargon was.
Un.
Freaking.
Believable.
Pike and Spong are allowed to be Heretics Unhinged, and no action is taken to protect the integrity of the Faith. +Duncan takes action to protect the Faith, and he comes under decisive attack. Words fail me.
Bernini and Choir Stall, you’ve both smacked the nail right square on the head! Thank you!
I actually agree with Melnyk that it is about time. About time that we all realize that reformation of TEC from within ain’t going to happen. What you see of TEC is what you are going to get. If anything, it will only get worse. I understand that some folks of good faith believe they are called to stay and be a faithful remnant. I will never understand the desire to remain in Egypt when God offers deliverance, but God bless you in your martydom.
Bernini [#16] writes: “+Duncan takes action to protect the Faith, and he comes under decisive attack.”
If “the Faith” needs protection, quaere how it can be THE Faith.
It occurs to me that we really do have two religions under one roof. One sees faith as a snapshot, a once-for-all deposit of Absolute and Immutable Truth. The other sees faith as a movie, or, as the Rev. Barbara Brown Taylor puts it, as an openness to truth, whatever truth turns out to be. By and large (and with significant exceptions on both sides), the adherents of the movie religion seem much more willing to work and worship with the adherents of the the snapshot religion than vice versa.
[blockquote] At home, she has arrogated powers equivalent to an Episcopal form of Martial Law, [b] and no one calls her to account.[/b] [/blockquote]
I, among many, want to know WHY no one calls the Presiding Bishop to account. Please answer. Thank you.
Ok, DC, how about â€+Duncan takes action to [b]STAND FOR[/b] the Faith, and he comes under decisive attack.â€
Athanasius Returns raises a valid point. IS there some action that can be taken to reign in the PB of the denomination? Surely, there must be some checks and balances to prevent this type of abuse of power?
“I, among many, want to know WHY no one calls the Presiding Bishop to account”
Because they are afraid. Anybody who opposed the brownshirts brought immediate revenge on their heads. “Decent people” said nothing then also. They were afraid for their careers, and their lives and their children’s futures. Nobody called the Sanhedran to account either. They were afraid of getting kicked out of the synagogues. Their fear was well placed.
Why does +Ed Little, a “decent person” and orthodox in his trembling, cowering, kindly soul, go cap in hand to the ABC to beg a Lambeth appointment for Robbie, but says nothing to the ABC about interceeding for Duncan?
Strangely, I feel only pity for him, and the other “Windsor” cowards. I envy +Duncan. He is a man and a bishop. I also wonder whom I would be more like in their place, +Duncan or +Little? Perhaps I would run too. Probably so.
#20 – it is a bit more complicated. “Calling to account” has been tried and has failed (the Ritcher trial). Most who have had the inclination to attempt such a thing realize that there is no level playing field, or (to mix the metaphors) the cards are stacked against us. It is simply impossible to get a fair trial.
[#24] That isn’t really the issue. It is a given that no one in TEC will ever be successfully tried for heterodoxy. But in this case, we see KJS running roughshod over her own laws. The HoB seems to be acting like the Reichstag in the early 30’s – acquiescing as central authority arrogates power to itself. They sit idle (or worse! they cheer!) and watch it happen because it is a time of “emergency” and the Canons are too restrictive to allow effective action against the threat – and frankly, because they think the people on the other end of the cudgel deserve it. Well, power once taken will not be so easily laid aside. The tyrant soon finds he (or in this case ‘she’) rather likes being a tyrant. It solves so many difficult problems.
carl
This is just another example of entering into conversation and meaningful dialog.
But it is ok because the PB talks very politely and carries out her tyrants in great civility.
Politeness and civility defines what is a Christian after all.
#7 Phil:
[blockquote]I pray that we seek the faithfulness of the Apostles as we face our trials. Let this time drive us to our knees, rather than drive us to anger. The space between the sole of the foot and the knee is the level that will move the world. [/blockquote]
I admit my anger is so thick you could cut it with a butterknife, but it’s nothing to my fear. I am not a cradle Anglican . . . two churches brought me to Orthodox Anglicanism and the one I am at now is truly home. I can’t imagine leaving it, but my fears grow daily about the latest posturing to ensure that enough Orthodox members and clergy are driven out of the church to ensure those left behind can’t possibly block votes at General Convention to vote in the latest “new thing”. I know I need a blog break to calm myself down . . . and yet, here I am!
#21, libraryjim: Thank you, I’ll go with that.
#20, Athanasius Returns writes:
[blockquote]I, among many, want to know WHY no one calls the Presiding Bishop to account.[/blockquote]
Could it not be argued that, as presented in the audio files of a couple of weeks ago, that indeed, the clergy of South Carolina sought to do just that? I thought their questions to be respectful yet painfully to the point. This quote from the PB sums it all up: “I am very struck by our inability to communicate.”
She, and by extension, the rest of TEC, has been called to account. They refuse to listen.
What an awesome honor for Bishop Duncan. I mean this seriously.
To be hauled in front of a church council for the purpose of defending the faith! This is a fantastic opportunity for presenting the gospel on a world stage.
Thanks be to the Presiding Bishop for making this all possible!
I am not in the least being sarchastic – this is going to be an amazing event that all of us who beleive the Gospel, should aspire to – to be called on our faith and be able to articulate clearly to the world what we believe, in whom we believe and how we believe.
Dospeed Bishop Duncan – you are a hero and COURAGE BEGETS COURAGE!
Sorry – that was supposed to be “Godspeed” Bishop Duncan.
AMEN, RickW!!
In light of the botched job she pulled with today’s two depositions, I can’t wait for her to try her hand at this. KJS and DBB are dangerous and it’s time to be shed of them.
My apologies if I am asking a question already answered, but for what is she planning to depose Bp. Duncan? Abandonment of communion? His diocese has voted to succeed, but that’s not a done deal. He hasn’t attempted to resign the HOB. For what can she actually depose him?
#33: ‘His diocese has voted to succeed’.
I hope so, but perhaps you meant ‘secede’? Words matter!
Ah! busted! hahaha! yes, indeed! secede… and me a southern boy.
Now! Let me renew my question.